Wife serves me the "news" while abroad

You can ask yourself for hours on end, why didn''t XXX do YYY? But the fact is, she just didn''t, because she didn''t want to. At the end of the day that is the only reason that matters. If she wanted to share her thoughts with you, then she would have. If she wanted to go to MC, she would have. If she wanted to save the marriage, she would have.

As they say in Batman Begins, it is not who you are underneath, but your actions that define you.

I wonder if you are "suffering" from the disease to please? Sounds to me that you are a caring and rescuing sort of person from what you have posted and that your wife is the sort of person who wanted that.

One thing that I have slowly learnt during the time I have spent getting divorced and in counselling is that I need to learn to stop firstly the urge to rescue people who ask and also have a good deal more knowledge of my own psycology and what makes me tick.

I had a relatively long marriage but looking back and being honest one of the main things that attracted me to my husband was that he really appeared to need me. Well I was wrong totally wrong.

Love is reciprical and is shown in actions and words. Endlessly loving and supporting one half whilst feeling sucked dry emotionally is no real long lasting recipe for a happy life.

I did ask my ex for a divorce a couple of years before he eventually left me and had an affair. At that point in my life I was so drained and beaten an bruised that I hadn''t even considered it a possibility that I could even get into another relationship let alone get out of my marriage by having an affair.

I think as some posters on here have said whether she is having an affair or not is really irrelevent and I would advise caution of hiring a private detective - firstly on the basis of cost but also bearing in mind she is draining you and has stated catagorically that the marriage is over - what is the point torturing yourself if she is or trying to convince yourself that continuing to try in this marriage is worth it when she is telling you NO?

One day it is just possible that you might find someone really worthy of your love who you can relate to on both an emotional and interlectual level.

Lifes a journey that is for sure and there are very few guarantees in life.

I agree with Cookie, in my opinion and this is only an opinion based on my experience and certainly not to be taken as the truth underlying your problem - when this happened to me, there was more to it than I was ever being told. That could be the reason why it was delivered to you by phone - otherwise, knowing her as well as you do, she could have feared you may have read her face, expression, body language.

It would also explain why she has been thinking about it for a long time but has not included you in on those thoughts or given you an inkling of an idea that she''s not happy with the way things are.

Usually the spouse is purposely left in the dark in favour of including someone else who is hearing all about her feelings, her marriage, what''s wrong with it and all the time getting closer to her, coming between the marriage partners and pushing further away the unsuspecting spouse, who should be the recipient of all this information and at least be given the opportunity to respond and work on the issues before things go too far. Sadly, usually before the spouse is told or finds out, it has gone too far and he/she is presented with a fait accompli - it''s over, I love you but I''m not in love with you.

The 3rd party meanwhile is presenting a blinding image - has none of the spouse''s weaker points, every one of the spouse''s good points only better, and much much more.

By the time the unsuspecting spouse is dealt the shocking blow of the ''love you but not in love with you'' line*, the one who is leaving has done all their thinking, ably aided and assisted by the 3rd party, made their decision and will not reconsider.

(*The odd part about that line being spun I think, again only my observation, is that you surely need a benchmark or control (in the form of another person) to determine whether you are ''in love'' with or you just ''love'' your spouse of some years. Otherwise how can you differentiate? How do I know I am not ''in love'' with you unless I am comparing what I feel for you to what I am feeling for someone else ?

Can I compare what I feel for you to a state of mind I call ''in love'' - though this exists not in the reality of my feelings for another, but only in my imagination? Yet this is so Absolute and certain and strong that I am willing to take the enormous step of breaking up my family? Let alone giving up my 5 bed home, live-in nanny, supportive spouse who I LOVE and bringing my beloved children up between divorced parents ! Really ?) - sorry I digress - we need a new thread on this one !

Perhaps you should ask your wife how she knows she is not ''in love'' with you any more, what is she comparing her love for you to? When did loving you become not enough ? The answer would be interesting. In the absence of not being able to give you any sensible answer, what they previously said usually starts to morph into ''well I''m not really sure I was ever really in love with you/loved you''.
They can''t say, well I thought I was in love with/loved you until X came along and then I realised by comparison that ..... And with any credibility they can''t say, well I know we''ve got two little kids and a good life and I love you but I''ve got this thing in my head about what being in love really is and given it doesn''t match what we have after Y number of years you know what I''m gonna take a chance out there in the big wide lonely unpredictable world ..... It doesn''t make sense. Especially for a woman who is insecure ?

That tends to be what happens, in leaving out what makes sense (someone else involved) they give us all this nonsense that try as we might we can make no sense out of.

My opinion only again, but in situations where there is no underlying problems such as abuse, alcoholism or other sinister issues afoot, which does not seem to be the case here from what you have said, mature spouses with little children, good living standards (live-in nannies!), loving and supportive husbands who they in turn love do not give all that up because they decide they are not ''in love'' any more but have moved on to ''living and loving'' and that''s not good enough. Do they ?

Unless there is someone else influencing them so to do.

I really hope this doesn''t turn out to be the case for you and that you and your wife can sort out these difficulties and move on bringing your children up in the context of a loving family. The world of divorce can be a very ugly one indeed. My best wishes, Nige.

Nigella - Sadly, you are so absolutely spot on. Just one thing to add....I remember reading that a new love interest brings a surge of hormones which put the body on a constant ''high,'' something akin to a drug habit. That is why people do some incredibly insane things when they are engaged in an affair.
Like they say Love Is Blind

Hacked off - yep I also understand that to be true, it is all part of the infatuation stage of a new love interest. The Collins English Dictionary defines infatuate as to inspire or fill with a foolish, shallow, extravagant passion ! Even the extravagant bit made sense to me - when I discovered the life savings had been embezzled as well as credit run up all over town on the tart ! Nige.

soulruler wrote:

I wonder if you are "suffering" from the disease to please? Sounds to me that you are a caring and rescuing sort of person from what you have posted and that your wife is the sort of person who wanted that.

One thing that I have slowly learnt during the time I have spent getting divorced and in counselling is that I need to learn to stop firstly the urge to rescue people who ask and also have a good deal more knowledge of my own psycology and what makes me tick.

I had a relatively long marriage but looking back and being honest one of the main things that attracted me to my husband was that he really appeared to need me. Well I was wrong totally wrong.

Love is reciprical and is shown in actions and words. Endlessly loving and supporting one half whilst feeling sucked dry emotionally is no real long lasting recipe for a happy life.

I did ask my ex for a divorce a couple of years before he eventually left me and had an affair. At that point in my life I was so drained and beaten an bruised that I hadn''t even considered it a possibility that I could even get into another relationship let alone get out of my marriage by having an affair.

I think as some posters on here have said whether she is having an affair or not is really irrelevent and I would advise caution of hiring a private detective - firstly on the basis of cost but also bearing in mind she is draining you and has stated catagorically that the marriage is over - what is the point torturing yourself if she is or trying to convince yourself that continuing to try in this marriage is worth it when she is telling you NO?

One day it is just possible that you might find someone really worthy of your love who you can relate to on both an emotional and interlectual level.

Lifes a journey that is for sure and there are very few guarantees in life.

I dont know if it''s a disease to please, more like a power trip. Or is that the same thing. Not a nice thing to say I know but I need to be honest with myself (I''m not a power crazed control freak if anyone is wondering). Perhaps I''m the insecure one. I enjoy helping people or having them rely on me that it makes me feel good about myself. Anyway enough of that, I''ll save all that for the therapist.

Yes I do feel she has been relying on me and "needed me so much. Which is why her choice of leaving me has made her feel so good. Its her decision that no one can change.

I''m not going to the extremes of hiring a PI, but it would be good to know her actions and reasoning is because of the A. I could get closure and put my mind to rest.

Thanks for the vote of confidence. You''re right there is a life after divorce and there is someone out there that wants my love and is happy for who I am. I''m not a monster, I have my faults and made mistakes, but I have been a loving supporting partner and father. Maybe time to find someone who appreciates that.

Hacked Off wrote:

Nigella - Sadly, you are so absolutely spot on. Just one thing to add....I remember reading that a new love interest brings a surge of hormones which put the body on a constant ''high,'' something akin to a drug habit. That is why people do some incredibly insane things when they are engaged in an affair.
Like they say Love Is Blind

I''ve read this as well. The sad thing is, like a drug, it comes to an end and the high becomes a massive downer.