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What are we each entitled to in our divorce settlement?

What does the law say about how to split the house, how to share pensions and other assets, and how much maintenance is payable.

What steps can we take to reach a fair agreement?

The four basic steps to reaching an agreement on divorce finances are: disclosure, getting advice, negotiating and implementing a Consent Order.

What is a Consent Order and why do we need one?

A Consent Order is a legally binding document that finalises a divorcing couple's agreement on property, pensions and other assets.


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An explaination!

  • CollaborativeFamilyLaw
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19 Sep 07 #3673 by CollaborativeFamilyLaw
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Smidge, whilst I agree with your comments, most of those who post on these forums have been through a hell of a lot and I daresay that they have developed a fairly tough skin. Robust debate is ok, whilst OBE and Louise may take issue with my comments, and feel that I need to be pushed back into my box, mush of their overall copntributions are positive and sensible.

As for your collaborative experience...can you tell us more?

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20 Sep 07 #3678 by OBEs 1 canoodly
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Smidge

There are no personal attacks on here just healthy opinions because we none of us are the same. If we were, solicitors would definately be out of business.

Please do tell about your Collaborative Law experience???

We are all waiting to hear with bated breath!! It would be great to hear something good about the legals!! As Londongreek says we have all had some very bad experience through divorce and develop thick skins.....Mmmmm not so sure about that you can still see through mine at least I think OBEs ex has tried to!! Eeeek opened myself up again to Fi!!!

Can't wait to hear what has happened to you!

Nice ones

OBEs1

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20 Sep 07 #3679 by OBEs 1 canoodly
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My dear LondonGreek!!

Such nice comments you make about me I feel quite humble!

Having been through this with my OBE we are now coming to some closure with his divorce. Cards on the table offers now made his ex not wanting to be exposed in court on Friday - something to hide me thinks???

She has taken us down this very expensive path that he would have quite liked to have negotiated over a year ago and come to the same conclusion that has arisen today!! AND she would have been 10k better off!!

So all I would say to you now if you can understand the way it is translated with a keyboard that doesn't have the greek alphabet......

Then Eka Polle leftar!!!!!

and if you understand that my friend you will know I used to live close to a very huge greek community with many friends and lots of Greek weddings in North London in my former life!!!

  • wscowell
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20 Sep 07 #3686 by wscowell
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I too am surprised at devlopments on this thread over the last few days. At great risk to (virtual) life and limb I'll chuck in my two penn'orth. There are definitely solicitors out there who milk clients as cash cows. No doubt at all. But I would regard them as in the minority from my experience, dinosaurs. And don't forget, unless you are a solicitor, I have met and work with/against many more than you!

But, for example, I am currently getting "hurry up and issue proceedings" noises from a lady client. "I am fed up with him, I am angry, I want to take control, he is deliberately delaying things, etc". I am saying to her "Be patient, there are reasons for things not being done immediately, it will cost you a lot of money to issue proceedings, can you afford it" etc. She will be the first to blame me later when she sees her costs start to rise, no matter how much I warned her in advance. When emotions get in the way, people can do dumb things.

Court rules force parties (i.e. their solicitors) to do a lot of paperwork. We didn't choose the system, we don't like it, the Court is trying to ensure fair play is done and the paperwork is a way of achieving that. Why shouldn't the solicitors be paid for the time the Courts (or their clients) oblige them to spend on cases?

If my client insists on tying up half an hour of my working day saying something she could (and should) have said in 5 minutes, fair play. But she knows she is paying for my time. We are running a business.

Speaking of which, let's look at some numbers. The average high street solicitors make about £150k on every million of turnover. That's a 15% profit margin. Businesses normally expect 50 or 60% margin. Our overheads are enormous, every firm is the same there.

The average high street solicitor earns £27-40k. For a skilled professional, with ongoing training year in, year out, that is peanuts. Some of my truck driver clients earn more than I do, and I am a partner, head of family law here.

If we charge £180 per hour, about £160 vanishes in overheads. And any number of clients just bugger off and don't pay us at all, year in, year out. That's the system we have to work within. We are conscientious, and really want a quick, sensible outcome for the client so that they can get on with their lives with minimum emotional harm, and maybe recommend us to their friends.

If we didn't believe in what we are doing, we wouldn't be working in family law. What hurts is the almost universal contempt we are held in for trying to do a good job for people, while tied in a strait jacket. For those out there who cut us a little slack, thank you. Regardless of your prejudices, we will continue to be here, and continue to try to help.

Will C

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20 Sep 07 #3688 by PETAL
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Totally agree.

My sol however bangs his head off the wall as my ex wont communicate therefore increasing my bills cause I try to make him. He is stuck between a wall of helping me but cant cause other party refuses.

However do think law could make the other party reply. Going to court my stbx decided and then forgets to hand in paperwork on dates given Im well confuses as he applied an relief not me.

Thing is arguing over debt in an expensive case for nothing when all he had to do is reply to a simple offer in a letter!!!!!!!

Why do courts offer an relief to people with no assets? Not your fault as a solicitor.

Anyway I always pay my bill and try not no even phone my sol if not needed infact we try to keep costs down.

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20 Sep 07 #3689 by TMax
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mmm I once had a sol who propsed a delaying taticto put the Xs cost up by not giving the info required and let them use the court to get it. they were dropped that very day. But "if I knew then" what she was going to do :-)id of delayed it all every step of the way.

  • Louise11
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20 Sep 07 #3690 by Louise11
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Hi there all I havent bowed out of this post just yet! LOL

Smidge,
So where o where do we go to vent our anger? On the streets? Nah better to be on here and have a rant at the computer, its not real in here its virtual reality, its just that it keeps answering back!
the only thing I found that made me angry on this post was the comment….”The English “something for nothing culture” sickens me. I just found it offensive but hey ho I’m half English (the other side of me is German!) Not really a good mix is it? Rofl Offend me and get a tongue lashing.
Besides which if you have a look at the guy who said it, his profile “I’m his only friend” So awww me no want to fall out with Billy no mates! Hahaha

Fiona
I think you say in your post to me somewhere (cant be 100% certain as I have slept since reading it lol) that I don’t put myself in the Ex wife’s position, I can assure you I wouldn’t want to, she drinks 14 cans of Stella a day. But to explain me as a person, your wrong , if I see a problem I look at it from every different angle I can, every time a letter or something happens I put myself in the other persons position and look at it from all points of view.
When all this started I didn’t want to be brought into this, it was between them two, I even met his wife on a few occasions and we seemed to get on, I find it all a bit surreal to be honest, it really all started when SHE (and the fact that we got married) got another new partner, what a plonker this guy is, he honestly causes so much trouble, (mind you at the FDR, I warned this fella that its not over for him yet as maybe when HIS wife starts AR after she hears from ME then maybe he will know just what it feels like!) we havent seen hide nor hair of him since! He never even came to the FH, hiding round the corner in his car he was!
We met them once to have a chat ect ect, had a nice time really till she drank 2/3 shots after her 14 pints then started to demand 80k from ME! We left.
I actually feel quite sorry for the silly woman, and if I hear she’s been crying because of something that’s happened I feel quite upset, but then I think she’s brought all this on herself, she’s greedy, she’s not given one iota to how we have felt throughout all this. I feel she’s one of life’s victims, she has definitely been used by her Solicitors for every penny and that’s what I find sad, but through her greed or stupidity, o I dunno I just know she’s been ripped off big time.
As for Collaborative Law, contrary to you thinking it’s seems to be the Nps that don’t want this OH MY GOD nothing could be further from the truth, as far as I can see it’s a fantastic idea on paper, but no one counts on human emotions and that’s where it comes unstuck, its would have been fantastic in my ex husband and my case because we were reasonable people who got on, but if that’s the case we wouldn’t of needed their “help” anyway . But I do understand people do. So if it works for them then so be it, I’m all for it.

Will C
I TOTALLY understand where you are coming from, just one point really I thought by issuing Form A and getting things moving then in theory it should keep things simple and everyone keeps to a timetable, that moves things along nicely, I thought by issuing Form A, you all keep to the court timetable and hey presto all done and dusted in around 6 months!
Whats the point in 6 months of tooing and frooing of paperwork between Lawyers for voluntary disclosure at a cost to their clients of god knows what, when at the end of it the route will be form E. Then the fun starts there because no one seems to adhere to it. Take ours, they ask for 12 months bank statements, they receive 12 months bank statements, they send 3 months bank statements, we say nope we want 12 months , they say that’s all your getting! We say ok we will ask a Judge, Judge orders 12 months with a Penal notice attached, they respond by sending 4 months statements , we respond by asking Judge again, Judge responds with a court order and a penal notice, they don’t bother with the order and say the Judge is wrong???????????? Has anything happened? Nope we then get informed if we want the order carried out, I.e. the penal notice we have to issue another form and pay £80!!!!!!! In my book if a Judge orders something say on Monday to happen in 14 days surely the Judge should look in 14 days to see if their order has been carried out, if not the Judge should order them back to court, but of course that doesn’t happen so on and on it goes. We have asked for her pension CETV for 3 years, they say she hasn’t got one, we get to the FH they say o she has gone one, but Your honour its not worth much????????? So the FH gets adjourned and Judge orders her to get it, That was May 15th, the NEW FH is Oct 8th and 9Th have we received the CETV have we heck, all they do now is ring my home and keep saying “off the record“ Mr so and so would you be willing to accept????. it’s a complete nightmare and has been from day 1!

As for the figures you quote £180 per hour and £160 disappears in overheads, my god I’d change your accountant if I were you! Or let me do your books! Your not fiddling enough!
As for the universal contempt you are all held in for trying to do a good job, your not ALL held in contempt at all, its only the few and minority on here who hold this view me included because we have been treated with contempt by so many of you, we have been bullied, belittled, we have had letters demanding outrageous things, if you read some of the posts you will see just how many in your profession try to lie and cheat their way to success.
I totally understand that every day people use Solicitors and have a good rapport, they help people and deal with some terrible things, I also think that most solicitors will do a good job for many of their clients, I just feel they don’t need to lie and cheat to get there.
Besides which if you knew the Job I once did and the Job my husband still does then you will no the answer as to why we as two professions don’t always see eye to eye! Lol.
You’re held in universal contempt?? Join the club! Lol


So Londongreek I love you, like I love Wil C and Fiona, in fact I LOVE EVERYBODY and just want the world to be a nicer place. I want everybody to love everybody and make peace not war. Nuff said

Kind ones everyone
Louise :P

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